Another normie dilemma

35  2018-02-20 by Fat__

94 comments

Nobody denies that sexual attraction matters in relationships. However it is true that in a relationship, attraction is influenced by more factors than in a random encounter between strangers, where there's little opportunity to consider anything other than looks and initial charm.

Nope otherwise females would fuck the betas they put in orbit instead.

Industrial-strength blackpill. IT incels will not be able to respond to this one.

Holy fuck you're dumb. People in "orbit" are people with attraction to the person in question while said person has no attraction for them, your argument in no way reflects any semblance of reality yet you tout it as gospel.

Which is exactly my fucking point you retard. LOOKS. Now stop stalking my posts you creep.

stop stalking my posts

This is coming from the guy who went through my entire post history to find a picture of me.

You're also the moron who can't explain his own views on love so he tells people to kill themselves instead.

No one has ever said that sexual attraction "doesn't matter" in relationships. Only that it matters LESS than incels claim.

In one night stands, looks are going to be nearly 100% of what is considered. In a relationship there are factors other than pure physical attraction to be considered.

Women love dominance and power. If you demonstrate you're on top of the social hierarchy, you have a reasonably high likelihood of getting laid (in a one night stand) even if you're ugly.

Example? If Trump wanted to get a one night stand with some randokm hoe, he could easily do so. It's not looks. It's LMS.

I've always had success with women by being honest, interesting and funny. My looks are average, my money is not impressive, and my status is nonexistent.

I don't think this rule applies for anything except club hookups that incels seem obsessed with as the sole arbiter of sexual success.

I've always had success with women by being honest, interesting and funny. My looks are average, my money is not impressive, and my status is nonexistent.

Well I'll admit the amount you sincerely believe this is funny so I'll give you that. but if honesty and being interesting all an incel would have to do to get a girlfriend would be explain how fucked over we are.

if honesty and being interesting all an incel would have to do to get a girlfriend would be explain how fucked over we are.

Bitching and moaning about your life doesn't make you interesting. A woe is me attitude is a pretty quick way to lose everyone's interest.

Judging by everyone coming here to laugh at us incels are pretty interesting and funny, we should have floods of high quality women throwig themselves at us for being honest but instead they'd just think we were crazy and try to run away and call the police.

No, people don't come here because you're funny. People come here to gawk at how insane you all seem. People outside this bubble don't experience the world the way you claim we do. It's interesting in a sad way to see people so devoted to their delusion.

You don't need to be funny to have people laugh at you, you can just be an perceived as pathetic instead, and you said yourself "it's interesting to see people so devoted to their delusion" so we are interesting in some form.

But not in a way that anyone will be romantically attracted to.

Serial killers are interesting, but I'm not going to be attracted to them (cue incels screaming that women love serial killers)

Bitching and moaning about your life doesn't make you interesting. A woe is me attitude is a pretty quick way to lose everyone's interest.

Have you ever considered that most incels vent on the Internet entirely because they know people IRL don't want to listen to people who complain?

then you don't have read it.

Then he wouldn't have anything that makes him feel better about his life though.

True, I shouldn't have stepped on that boundary. Now I'm in for it!

Are you white in a western country?

Yes, I am.

Let me guess, "Of course you have success with women! You're white! They're probably still all 2/10 landwhales, though!!"

I don't care the quality of women you choose to date, but it's ignorant to not realize white men have an advantage in dating.

In online dating, it's true that white men have an advantage according to statistics. But I haven't met any of my long term partners online.

Besides it varies from week to week in the incel community who has the advantage. For a while it was only BBC that could possibly get laid. Then it was tall guys can't me incel.

Why do you think dating trends shift between online and in real life? If people like thing A online, it's safe to assume they like thing A offline as well.

Because offline introduces a ton of new variables. Online consists of physical appearance, and a few sentences of text. IRL features body language, all sorts of nonverbal communication, personality, etc.

Maybe you wouldn't have thought that Asian guy was hot shit on Tinder, but he's chatting you up and making you laugh and he suddenly seems more appealing. Attraction can build based on actual proximity and interaction, despite what incels claim.

it matters LESS than incels claim.

Would you get into a committed relationship with a girl you're not physially attracted to? Like, not at all?

Would you get into a committed relationship with a girl you're not physially attracted to? Like, not at all?

No, I would have to be physically attracted to her on some level. But if I'm dating a 5/10 and a 7/10, the 5/10 can easily win my favor by being more compatible with me on a personality level. Most people don't make their dating decisions based on maximizing the attractiveness of their partner.

You still have to meet a threshold, but that will be different for every person.

But if I'm dating a 5/10 and a 7/10, the 5/10 can easily win my favor by being more compatible with me on a personality level.

Top fucking kek.

You do realise that the 10 point scale doesn't end at 5/10? That there are guys at legit 1's, 2's, 3's? You do realise that there are hundreds of thousands of them? Would you go on their forums to spout platitudes about how you'd settle for a 5/10?

Because this is exactly what you're doing. And the best part is that you think you're helping.

You do realise that the 10 point scale doesn't end at 5/10? That there are guys at legit 1's, 2's, 3's?

I acknowledge that these people exist. I always acknowledge that there are people too ugly to have an easy time finding someone attracted to them. Still not impossible. But it will be harder and you'll need to compensate by being legitimately charming in other ways.

But most people are not 2/10. Most people on here aren't either, despite what you all scream. Every single time an incel shows their photo they are totally average looking.

That's because most of us don't post our pictures.

Just curious, why don't most of you really ugly folks, those too afraid to post a picture even here of all places, just kill yourselves? I mean if it's really that bad, why waste the time? I'd just grab my trusty shotgun and blam-o.

Fear of death.

Damn, ya'll really can't win, can you?

ya'll

YEEEEEEEEEEEHAAAAAAAAAWWWWW

Now fuck off, sonny.

ya'll

YEEEEEEEHAWWWWWWW!

YEEEEEEHAAAAWWWWW

And yet ugly/fat women get one night stands all the time. Hmmm really makes you think.

Sounds like there's a lot of men out there who will stick their dick in anything that moves.

That would seem to speak more poorly of men than women, but I'm sure you see some way this proves women are evil and disgusting monsters.

So do plenty of men. These are the ones having sex with the ugly and fat women. You can too. You just have to actually try and not give up.

Wait that first button is obviously wrong. Sexuality is crucial in all relationships, from one night hook ups to long term relationships

And yet that blatant lie is told to us all the time.

No it’s not. Saying personality is important does not mean you don’t need sexual attraction.

Yes it is.

I'm not arguing that personality ISN'T important. It is important not to be an utter cunt, however people come in here and straight up tell us that ugliness doesn't hold you back. Just lol, as if anyone was stupid enough to believe that BS.

It doesn’t put you ahead. But it doesn’t disqualify you either. It’s just one part of the picture.

It doesn’t put you ahead. But it doesn’t disqualify you either. It’s just one part of the picture.

A very large part of the picture. Like nearly all of it.

No it’s not. It’s funny that so many people who have never had a relationship are so sure of how they work and completely dismiss those of us who HAVE had relationships.

No it’s not. It’s funny that so many people who have never had a relationship are so sure of how they work

I mean, yeah, since we can actually see how similar we are to every person in a relationship and the only difference is how ugly we all are, it's pretty easy to see how they work.

and completely dismiss those of us who HAVE had relationships.

Yeah, I tend to dismiss privileged classes when they try to "educate" me on how they "totally earned" their status

The only difference isn’t how ugly you are. It’s your attitude. “All women are awful which is why I can’t get a date though I’d never consider dating a woman who isn’t a virgin who’s under 20 with a side job as a model.” And furthermore, no one is in a “privileged class” just because they’ve managed to have sex. A guy with a moderately bad case of Downs syndrome I went to high school with is engaged. Not to a “Stacey” though. To someone else with Downs.

All you have to do to have sex and be in a relationship is to not be a shitty person and to only pursue people on your level. If your face looks like you had an accident with a chainsaw when you were a kid then go talk to the girl who looks like the female version of the elephant man.

The only difference isn’t how ugly you are. It’s your attitude. “All women are awful which is why I can’t get a date though I’d never consider dating a woman who isn’t a virgin who’s under 20 with a side job as a model.”

Thats not at all my attitude, youre thinking of the stereotype you've been fed about us. I'll literally be with any woman so long as she doesn't abuse me.

And furthermore, no one is in a “privileged class” just because they’ve managed to have sex. A guy with a moderately bad case of Downs syndrome I went to high school with is engaged. Not to a “Stacey” though. To someone else with Downs

Whites, women, the wealthy, and attractive men are all privileged classes and all of which increases your chances of having sex. You're thinking about it in the wrong direction. They're not privileged because they have sex, they have sex because they are privileged.

All you have to do to have sex and be in a relationship is to not be a shitty person and to only pursue people on your level.

Well, I'm not a shitty person and I've pursued plenty of people "on my level". You could think I'm a shitty person now though because of the hundreds of women "on my level" (and below) rejecting me and pursuing 8/10 men, which leaves a bit of a frustration in me. But that's not why I'm not getting women, that's because I'm not.

Also being a shitty person never stopped women from fucking Chad, every wifebeater in history by definition was married to a woman. Why didn't those women sense that their fiance was a shitty person? Why is it they can somehow sense my posts on an anonymous internet forum just by looking at me?

If your face looks like you had an accident with a chainsaw when you were a kid then go talk to the girl who looks like the female version of the elephant man.

They go for 8/10 men. Women don't date sideways, women date up (whether in class or in looks). All women.

the backpedaling, goalpost shifting in this thread

I love it.

Retards, all of them. Actual fucking retards

Embodied Meme Lookup Tables

People become more attractive when you like them, and even more attractive when there's a strong emotional connection.

Physical attractiveness plays a part in long-term relationships, especially for getting started, but it's not what keeps them going.

it's not what keeps them going.

Why would someone, who's too unattractive to get a relationship at all, care what keeps one going?

Because you can be likable and build a connection prior to entering a relationship. You can be funny and charming and enjoyable to be around, even for only a short time, and the impact is significant.

If you're out looking for a one night stand where the whole point is physical attraction, then yeah, you're not gonna have much luck if you're not pretty. But physical attraction is only a single component of relationships.

physical attraction is only a single component of relationships.

But a component that HAS to be there, unconditionally. Everyone who claims, they would get into a long-term committed relationship with someone they're not physically attracted to AT ALL (AT ALL), is a liar.

You'd have to be a one in a million case for it to be impossible for a woman to be even a little bit attracted to you. Wallow in self-pity if you want, but I really doubt you're that bad. I've seen a good amount of "incel" pics, and not a single one has been below 4. Many are closer to 6. Attraction isn't an all-or-nothing deal, and like I said, it grows with personal connection. I'm not going to sit here and tell you that looks don't matter, or that you have just as many options as Chad. But if you're willing to have the right mindset - and I'm not referring to ultra-cuck self-hating gargantuan effort, just a basic willingness to try and the humility to acknowledge mistakes - you've got a shot.

I've seen a good amount of "incel" pics, and not a single one has been below 4. Many are closer to 6.

Have you considered that the actually 1/10, 2/10 and 3/10 guys are too ashamed to post their faces publically? I thought it's obvious but apparently not for everyone.

Even if you consider just the bottom 1% of men, the very most genetically unfortunate, there's EIGHT HUNDRED THOUSAND of them in the US alone. Imagine a room of 100 random guys and pick the very ugliest of them. For men like that it is - for intents and purposes - impossible to attract a woman.

Why are you so hell-bent on disturbing one of the very last places they have in this world? You can share your feelings and opinions literally anywhere else. Do you also go to terminal cancer meetups to tell the dying about your plans for the future?

Get ready to be mocked for comparing romantic woes with cancer. It just never stops.

If you don’t care then why post about it.

Sexually preferring your partner to other partners is important at any stage of a relationship. What wanes in importance is looks-based attraction. It's edged out by nonphysical attraction; not replaced entirely, but the balance shifts noticeably.

But to get into a relationship in the first place you HAVE to pass the attractiveness check. That's why theres incels.

Of course. But it's not like "the attractiveness check" is this impenetrable wall of hotness. Whether you spark the interest of someone depends on that person's preferences, where you are, how their day was, the outfit you're wearing, etc. And it's vanishingly unlikely that those odds never work out in your favor, even if they more often work out in those of other men.

The "hit the gym, take a shower, buy new clothes" shtick is stupid because it's akin to telling a poor person "well, why not go without your daily Starbucks?" But that doesn't mean it isn't good advice. It's about improving your odds. After that, it's a waiting game.

But it's not like "the attractiveness check" is this impenetrable wall of hotness.

For some men it IS impenetrable.

If you consider just the bottom 5% in attractiveness, the most genetically unfortunate of men, there's still EIGHT MILLION of them in the US alone. And when 8 thousands of them get together to vent on an internet forum you just can't help yourself but come and spout the same shit that's been spouted a million times before.

Why? Does it make you feel better about yourself to look at people even less fortunate than you? Is this some kind of sadistic pleasure?

Because you guys are the Internet equivalent of an injured animal wailing in the distance. Of course I'm going to come and see what's happening.

I think people in the bottom 5% of attractiveness are mostly unattractive because of controllable factors, e.g. morbid obesity and drug addiction. I don't know anyone who is just genetically poorly enough to make dating impossible. Do they exist? I'm sure, unfortunately. Do most of the men here fit that bill? I'm sure not.

I think people in the bottom 5% of attractiveness are mostly unattractive because of controllable factors, e.g. morbid obesity and drug addiction.

Absolute nonsense.

At birth some people have better (more attractive) genetics than others, so of course you will have a bottom 50%, a bottom 10%, and a bottom 5%. You can lift, shower and do all the obvious stuff, but you will always be in the bottom 5% genetically.

Imagine a guy who's short, balding, with recessed chin and narrow shoulders. Not technically deformed or ill, but still repulsive to women. All because of his bone and hair genetics. This is what I mean by bottom the bottom 5%.

In other words, no one gives a fuck what you think. Reality is not a just-world fairytale where the underdog wins in the end.

Not going to read the rest of your comment, but do you really expect me to believe you don't care what I think when you've put this much effort into convincing me I'm wrong? (Which I'm not, by the way).

Women may overestimate the role personality plays in their own attraction, but this sub is overwhelmingly full of bad personality. Let's put 2 and 2 together.

Not going to read the rest of your comment

Because acknowledging the existence of genetically failed men, who can't do anything about their predicament, goes contrary to your just-world fallacy, in which hard work and good personality in the end prevail against all odds.

this sub is overwhelmingly full of bad personality.

Then to convince us (and yourself) that since we suffer we must be bad people - because this is how the world works, right?

You're really nothing special. It's like they make you guys in a factory or something.

you guys are the Internet equivalent of an injured animal wailing in the distance. Of course I'm going to come and see what's happening.

The amount of zoo visitors this place has been getting is becoming kind of ridiculous.

True. It feels like more than half of the content here is produced by rubberneckers, which makes it less entertaining, but I think the guys who post here do so specifically to argue with people (because there are some incel hubs far more exclusive than this one).

Ever think that you're indulging them by taking their posts seriously, thus validating them so they keep doing it?

That's not what this is really about. Young men will always be bitter and confused; it's something you have to grow out of. Whether y'all feel directly validated ("a girl is lying to me on the internet about women being evil!") or indirectly validated ("no girls will talk to me! women are evil!"), there's the same end result of malformed angst and misdirected frustration. I'm not responding because I want to change that. I don't think it's possible for anyone here to do so.

If people want to dehumanize you, you can't exactly assert your humanity from behind a keyboard. But you can at least cut through the echo chamber and make it a little harder for them to luxuriate in their self-pity.

Are you a woman?

Don't think it's relevant. There are a lot of men and women who agree with me.

So that's a yes. What a surprise, another roastie come here to lecture incels. "My boyfriend was an incel when we met teehee, he though no girls wanted him because he was 6'3 white and his jaw was too strong. It will get better guys trust me".

Women will never understand what it's like to be lonely and unwanted and you being here is an insult to all incels.

Wah.

Get off our sub roastie

No.

Hmm isn't it weird how this is a young men thing and not a young women thing? Why is that?

Rhetorical question? It comes down to pattern differences in puberty and late adolescence. Testosterone amplifies negative emotions and T levels are highest around 18-25. Teen girls experience mood swings but they are naturally punctuated and tend to fall off much earlier in age than with men, because female puberty ends a lot earlier. And because young women are normally much more mature than young men, they intentionally create social support networks, communicate their emotions, and performing emotional labor for each other, so they can externalize and contextualize their problems and don't build up emotional plaque. I don't pretend to know what adolescent male relationships look like, but I can't imagine they involve as many crying-on-each-others-shoulders sessions as mine do.

It's not because life sucks so hard for young guys. It does suck, for many of them, but that isn't why this community exists, because life sucks for a lot of young women too. They just deal with it better, because, well, they're able to. There you go.

And I think that's a whole lot of bullshit.

The reason why women have better support networks is because they are inherently more valuable. Also, nobody gives a fuck about men's emotions. Especially not these women who are so able to "communicate their emotions".

They just deal with it better, because, well, they're able to.

They have it easier on average.

Well, it's biology. Yes, young women normally don't care about the emotions of young men. I don't think there's anything particularly tragic about that. Young girls also create their own support networks, so I can't begin to understand what you mean when you say they have them because...they're valuable.

Can I ask how old you are? If you're under 25 I'm assuming you're still stuck in the T-haze and will emerge to join me on the other side some day soon.

People like you think your ugliness is why you can’t get a girl, but there plenty of ugly ass dudes I’ve seen with a cute girl.

You fail to realize (or pretend you don’t know) that the reason you can’t get a girl is because you’re pathetically socially awkward and weird, which makes everyone uncomfortable. Instead of improving that, you’ve made a pathetic excuse and convinced yourself it’s your looks which can’t be fixed.

Bitch, you don't know every incels situation, ok? For every rare ugly dude who has a cute girlfriend, there's a 100 other ugly dudes who severely struggle.

you’re pathetically socially awkward and weird, which makes everyone uncomfortable.

you’re socially retarded

Why are you saying this? Do you know me? You don't, so fuck off.

I know right? Normies say sexual appeal and sex doesn't matter, and yet if you go on any normie sub and see someone complaining about sex the first answers are usually "leave them" or some other shit.

Sex is important.

Normies say that sexuality doesn't matter when there are incels around, but among themselves they clearly acknowledge that bad sex life = bad relationship.

That's because normies are two-faced scum that they pretend to hate.

Of course sexual attractiveness matters in relationships lol

Show them no mercy. They are worth less than cattle.

sexual attractiveness =/= sexuality

Sexuality is a result of sexual attraction

I can masturbate without thinking of anything and just flopping my dick around until it gets hard...this is sexuality without sexual attraction.

Why does it even matter? Relationshits are worthless cope. They only benefit women. I want SEX

I've never heard an adult claim sexual attractiveness isn't important to a relationship.

I think people in the bottom 5% of attractiveness are mostly unattractive because of controllable factors, e.g. morbid obesity and drug addiction.

Absolute nonsense.

At birth some people have better (more attractive) genetics than others, so of course you will have a bottom 50%, a bottom 10%, and a bottom 5%. You can lift, shower and do all the obvious stuff, but you will always be in the bottom 5% genetically.

Imagine a guy who's short, balding, with recessed chin and narrow shoulders. Not technically deformed or ill, but still repulsive to women. All because of his bone and hair genetics. This is what I mean by bottom the bottom 5%.

In other words, no one gives a fuck what you think. Reality is not a just-world fairytale where the underdog wins in the end.

you guys are the Internet equivalent of an injured animal wailing in the distance. Of course I'm going to come and see what's happening.

The amount of zoo visitors this place has been getting is becoming kind of ridiculous.

And yet that blatant lie is told to us all the time.

And I think that's a whole lot of bullshit.

The reason why women have better support networks is because they are inherently more valuable. Also, nobody gives a fuck about men's emotions. Especially not these women who are so able to "communicate their emotions".

They just deal with it better, because, well, they're able to.

They have it easier on average.

The only difference isn’t how ugly you are. It’s your attitude. “All women are awful which is why I can’t get a date though I’d never consider dating a woman who isn’t a virgin who’s under 20 with a side job as a model.” And furthermore, no one is in a “privileged class” just because they’ve managed to have sex. A guy with a moderately bad case of Downs syndrome I went to high school with is engaged. Not to a “Stacey” though. To someone else with Downs.

All you have to do to have sex and be in a relationship is to not be a shitty person and to only pursue people on your level. If your face looks like you had an accident with a chainsaw when you were a kid then go talk to the girl who looks like the female version of the elephant man.